To see what other writers are complaining and cheering about this month, you can find a list of this month's participants and links to their posts right... here.
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Okay, so what kinda support am I looking for this month? To tell the truth, I could use a little bit of commiseration and perhaps, an Amen, sister reassurance that some of you have experienced what I'm going through now.
What I'm talking about is representative of a grievous disrespect of Rodney Dangerfield proportions, a blatant and total disregard for my wishes, all neatly wrapped up in a complete lack of gratitude.
No, I'm not talking about other writers... or about the dear people who've read and reviewed my previous work. Nope, I'm talking about my own darned characters!
I mean, how could they??? If it weren't for me, the snotty little ingrates wouldn't even exist, so how is it possible, that after I, their benevolent creator, went to such great lengths to outline their personalities, experiences, and everything else about them in such painstaking detail, they've yanked the reins out of my hands and are running off willy-nilly in the directions they want to go? I'm the one who's supposed to be in control, right? I'm the one who should be guiding the horse... but it's taken off without me, leaving my bruised ego and stellar preconceptions lying in the dirt. What chutzpah!
Seriously... or as serious as I'm likely to get... in my first book, I felt more in control. This time, it really does feel like the characters are developing the way they want to develop, which is often at odds with what I'd planned for them. Verrrrrry weird. I've heard other writers mention this before, but just between you and me, I didn't think it was even possible... until it happened to me. Son of a gun. How about you? Do you control the direction of your plot, or have your characters staged an insurrection as well? (How dare they?)
Okay, this month's question is When do you know your story is ready?
Hmmm, interesting. For me, I write and rewrite and rewrite some more. Then I set it aside and try to ignore it for a while, before giving it another read-through with fresh eyes. (Yes, I know it's my same old not-so-fresh eyes, but gimme a break, okay? You know what I mean...) When I
The ingrates.
I get no respect. The way my luck is running, if I was a politician, I would be honest. [Rodney Dangerfield]
Until next time, take care of yourselves. And each other.
[NOTE: To my regulars, this is the only post for this week. Be back to our regular schedule next Friday. Seeya then!]
Let your characters take their chances and blossom. You're a momma, you'll know when to reign them in.
ReplyDeleteThat's what I'm doing so far. I figure I can clean up their potty mouths and whatnot in the second draft. :)
DeleteI suspect that your smart-assed characters will let you know when they want a good meal, some support, and some sprucing up. And, while not a writer, stories I have planned been epic failures because it was going in another direction. Whether I agreed or not.
ReplyDeleteThere ya go again! Sue, you ARE a writer, doggone it, and a very talented one, at that. Being published or not being published isn't part of the definition. (Although you COULD be if that's what you wanted.)
Delete"We're frauds and our talent is non-existent".
ReplyDeleteThat neatly sums up the feelings I've had every time one of my literary efforts was published. I honestly think it's the trait of a good writer and a serious one. Reasonable doubt rather than brash confidence is an asset.
Losing control of your characters?
It happens to me more often than I'd care to admit. Writers may THINK they're in control of their creations, but characters have minds of their own and enjoy taking us to places we never imagined.
Let them run rampant!
"Reasonable doubt rather than brash confidence..." Good way to put it. (You should sign up for the IWSG, Jon. Really.)
DeleteIt certainly does seem like the characters have minds of their own. (Kinda like the spontaneous appearance of fruit flies...) I'm letting them have their way for now, because I honestly want to see where they're taking me. (And yes, I know. That sounds totally insane.)
That sounds PERFECTLY sane to me!!
DeleteHA! That's because you're so unique. :)
DeleteI am in awe of people who can tell stories well without contorting characters into servants of the plot --or seeming to. Believe me, I tried --back in the '70s-- and the agent who read my work suggested I write historical articles. I raged, then wrote. They sold quite well. Now I blog and write whatever I like, and get the same pension as if I wrote nothing. It doesn't get more fun than that. I have great faith in your writing ability, more than I have in mine, and firmly believe you're equal to any goal you aim at.
ReplyDeleteThanks for the vote of confidence, dear dude, but you should have more confidence in your own writing ability. ONE agent told you that forty years ago??? (S)he could have been wrong. Judging by what you write on your blog, you've got talent out the wazoo... more than enough to do whatever you want to do with it. If you write a book, I hereby promise to buy it.
DeleteAmen, sister!! There, you got it. ;)
ReplyDeleteBut seriously, I think even though it's frustrating in the end it will be awesome that your characters are acting up. I bet the story will end up even better than what you'd originally planned. Good luck!!
Thank you!! :)
DeleteI hope you're right. Only time will tell. (And the second draft...)
It's interesting when characters do that, sort of like you're channeling them through your pen and then you look up and see what you wrote and say, "Huh." I've also had supposedly minor characters decide they want a bigger part. Nervy little buggers those characters.
ReplyDeleteYes! Exactly!
Deletehaha I've had characters that were meant to be one offs and then the little sobs keep stealing more and more page time and become integral.
ReplyDeleteWho knew the darlings we create could turn out to be such narcissists, eh?
DeleteThat can happen, for sure. And sometimes they demand a book of their own!
ReplyDeleteWhat nerve! :)
DeleteI've had characters go off and do things I hadn't planned. I've also had characters pop up that I didn't know would be in the story. But when that happens, I know it's going to be good. So I let them have their say and alter my plans to fit theirs. :)
ReplyDeleteIt's actually kinda cool that we can surprise ourselves with the way our own stories unfold. (We have to keep writing to find out what happens!)
DeleteI just figured out that a character, who I thought would be POV character but not necessarily a main one, is actually the protagonist of my WiP. Sheesh! It was like a slap in the face.
ReplyDeleteHA! Sounds like that character is strutting his stuff. But don't worry... he might slap you in the face, but YOU can torture him any old way you'd like. :)
DeleteSometimes I let my characters run rampant for a while. Such amazing things come out when they do, but inevitably, I rein them back in at some point. That free running? That's what short stories are for. =)
ReplyDeleteI'm actually enjoying the wild ride for now. As long as they deliver me safely to my planned destination, I'm good. (I may have to take over in the second draft, though. Can't let 'em get too uppity!)
DeleteOh yeah! First drafts are what they are anyway. May as well enjoy the ride. =)
DeleteIt's a fun ride so far!
DeleteListen to your characters! It may be frustrating, but they are usually right.
ReplyDeleteRiley Pendare/Pendragon was originally planned to be completely different -- a petty thief, like the Donovans. But from the first draft of the first chapter, he fought me tooth and nail. Good thing I gave up and let him become the person he really was! He's the backbone of the entire series!
I'm listening!
DeleteAnd I'm certainly glad you listened to Riley. :)
Hi Susan - love that your characters can just take over and take off - saddle backwards or forwards ... with your ability to tell stories ... you really should let us see more ... cheers and let them out - Hilary
ReplyDeleteHi Hilary. Yep, they just take off, and I'm hanging on for dear life. (And enjoying every minute of it.)
DeleteCheers back atcha.
It sounds like you have a mutiny on your hands! I wouldn't worry about it too much, though. Those characters came out of your brain, so hopefully you will have the ultimate control over their actions. :)
ReplyDeleteI know! They've got me tied up in the hold, and they're steering the ship wherever the heck they want to go. (Good thing I don't get seasick!)
DeleteYes, hopefully... :)
This crazed chicks loves it when the characters start taking on their own life. I guess it comes from living in chaos all the time...I'm just comfortable their. Hehe.
ReplyDeleteEnjoy.
(I'll throw in an Amen sister- just so you know I do care about your pain.)
No, no, it's not chaos... it's organized chaos. Big difference!
DeleteI'm actually having fun with the characters. Except for one guy, who really needs to clean up his potty mouth... (I mean, I don't talk like that; why should HE?)
My characters have been doing that too. I figured I didn't know them well enough when I started telling their story.
ReplyDeleteI THOUGHT I knew my characters really well before I started. I did in-depth character sheets and all that jazz, but evidently... I thought wrong!
DeleteIn my case, how would I even know if I have a story to tell?
ReplyDeleteLife is tough when there is no discernible talent.
I think everyone has a story to tell. And judging by your blog, you've got plenty of talent.
DeleteEvery time I try to control a character or plot, I’m blindsided. I had brilliant notes and beat points for my current manuscript, all of which fell by the wayside in executing the story. I’ve come to realize that as long as I know my characters’ core conflict—the inner conflict that will act as the catalyst for their change/journey—everything else has to play out on the page, and I’m okay with that. :)
ReplyDeleteVR Barkowski
Yes! You're exactly right! If we understand the conflict, and know where we want to take our characters, maybe it's a good thing to let them lead the way. :)
DeleteI have a character example: Jake Solomon of Solomon's Compass. He was supposed to come in midway, act as a catalyst, and exit. That's all. He showed up on the first day. I started over. He showed up even earlier. I said, "OK, cowboy. Show me whatcha got." He did :)
ReplyDeleteHA! Well, I'm glad you let that cowboy show you the way. :)
DeleteYou made me laugh. Those characters are proving that your creativity is in high gear. Keep it up!
ReplyDeleteI'm glad it made you laugh, because I was giggling while writing it. :)
DeleteThat happens me all the time. It's how I know the characters are "real" (ie, good characters with personality and stuff), if my subconscious can come up with their storylines without my having to think about it.
ReplyDeleteThey don't respect me, either, but I console myself with the knowledge that the little ingrates don't get their names on the cover if it gets published - I do. Mwahaha
HA! I like the way you think. :)
DeleteThose characters do seem to have a mind of their own. That's why I jump in without knowing anything before hand. Then I don't get angry when they go their own direction.
ReplyDeleteThat's a good way to do it. Without expectations, there can be no disappointment. (But lots of fun surprises!)
DeleteA great question with a hundred different answers. For me, I guess it's when I can sit down and read it as a reader and feel satisfied.
ReplyDeleteAnd that's a great answer! Before we were writers, we were readers. If we enjoy reading something we've written, others will, too.
DeleteNeed me to go all Ninja on those characters? Someone needs to put them back in line.
ReplyDeleteIf you wouldn't mind... :)
DeleteI've had a few run-ins with my characters, too. Sometimes a quick kick in the butt works. Other times I threaten to write them out of the story. Try these strategies out and let us know what happens!
ReplyDeleteGood ideas, but unfortunately, I need them more than they need me. :)
DeleteAs a pantser, that is how characters always act for me. Just go with the flow, and they'll lead you on a great story! :) And yes, fresh eyes help. I rely a lot on my critique partners.
ReplyDeleteI reckon, in spite of all my pre-planning and delusional belief that I had everything under control, I must be a pantser at heart. But that's okay, because so far, I'm enjoying the changes. Might as well let it play it out and see where they take me. It's only the first draft. :)
DeleteMy characters have always been in control. I love it, except when I don't. LOL I wanted to kill one of them and none of them would allow. I tried 3 times, still hasn't happened. :) They do make it fun though!
ReplyDeleteCan't wait to see where they take you!
I know exactly what you mean about loving it except when you don't. I keep trying to censor one of my characters, but that dude has a terrible potty mouth. (But I don't care what he says; I'm still gonna KILL him!)
DeleteHA! Yeah, I can't wait to see where they take me, either... :)
This makes perfect sense to me. After all, characters are your children...and when have you known children to listen to you, behave, and do what you want them to do all the time?
ReplyDeleteYeah, but if need be, we could send our kids to their rooms!
DeleteI've heard a lot of fiction writers discuss the utter disregard and lack of respect their characters have for them. I write nonfiction but want to write fiction. I guess this is what I have to look forward to.
ReplyDeleteYep, BIG difference between writing non-fiction and fiction. With non-fiction, the author IS in charge. With fiction, authorial control is somewhat of an illusion.
DeleteI've heard a lot of fiction writers discuss the utter disregard and lack of respect their characters have for them. I write nonfiction but want to write fiction. I guess this is what I have to look forward to.
ReplyDeleteJust like knowing what I'm doing on Blogger is somewhat of an illusion. I'd remove this duplicate comment, but I'm afraid the other one would disappear, too. :)
DeleteMy characters are often found doing the unexpected, in fact it is usually them that let me know the story is ready and I should let it go! Also a good idea to let a story rest for a little while before a final read through and I like to read that on my e reader as it seems to help give me a little distance too.
ReplyDeleteI agree wholeheartedly about reading the story on an e-reader. I can sniff out minor errors much more quickly on a Kindle.
DeleteHi Susan, It's too bad that you can't take away their deserts or TV privileges! You have great instincts and if your characters are going all Hatfield's and McCoy's on you maybe you need to put them in a western. You already have the horse with the backward saddle. You can even call it "Hot Beans and Cold Sarsaparilla!" Seriously, I know I'll laugh, cry and love whatever you write.
ReplyDeleteJulie
Hi-ya, Julie! Wassup???
DeleteHA! "Hot Beans and Cold Sasparilla." Love it.
Thanks. I just hope you laugh and cry at the places where I WANT those responses... :)
I'm far too insecure to even try and join in ... but that doesn't stop me from nodding like a bobble-head.
ReplyDeleteNot your point, but for some weird reason, this reminds me of a conversation with novelist J.A. Jance when I asked if she'd ever considered (approached, even) to sell the rights to a screen writer. (Because I compulsively draw characters' images in my mind while reading, I generally loathe books-turned-film.)
PS - In answer, Ms. Jance mouthed a emphatic "No!"
Hey, you might want to reconsider. The IWSG provides the perfect place to chop those annoying insecurities down to size.
DeleteYeah, talk about losing control! Screenwriters have a tendency to change novels so much, some of the characters are barely recognizable to their authors... and readers. (For example, I read a book years ago called "Youngblood Hawk." As you can probably guess, the title character was an American Indian. Know who played him in the movie? Blond-haired, blue-eyed Richard Chamberlain! (No, I didn't go see it...)
If they're taking over, let them write the story for you. Then you can sit back and supervise. Or eat donuts.
ReplyDeleteHey, now that sounds like a terrific plan! Too bad the ingrates can't type...
DeleteHa--I giggled at the title of your blog. Now I'm laughing out loud after reading the entire funny post. What a sense of humor. Oh, wait, you were kidding right??? Nope, I still don't believe the characters can take over. Sorry. I'm the boss. But in your case, if they do take over writing the book, and it's a HUGE success, then you can still take credit for it. If it's a FAILURE, you can say "the characters did it." Best wishes on your current WIP!!
ReplyDeleteJQ Rose
Yeah, I was kidding. (Mostly.) It's true that the characters have developed personalities somewhat different than what I'd planned, but I don't reeeeeeally think those changes were generated by THEM. (Or DO I...?)
DeleteThanks. Not everybody "gets" my weird sense of humor, so I'm pleased you do. :)
Congratulations! You have real characters (and if they're like my characters, they are REAL characters in every sense!)
ReplyDeleteSeriously: the hero of one of my stories, who appears in a number, started as a villain. I kid you not. Such a nifty villain, too. I sort of hated to lose him, except that he ended up bring quite a good hero. And the character who was supposed to be the hero ended up being a bit of a clown.
HA! Thanks. :)
DeleteI can definitely see how that kind of character morphing can happen. The character who's giving me the biggest fit right now is supposed to be an ignorant S.O.B. who does and thinks some really vile things. But doggone it, now I LIKE him, in spite of some of the things he does. (I'm still gonna kill him... HA!)
Ha! Such an amusing post! Let your characters run - they know where they're going and trust that you will guide them out of any brambles they get stuck in;-)
ReplyDeleteThe last time I looked at a story I've very much enjoyed writing, the character most likely to die a slow, painful death was showing signs of a change of heart. I'm almost afraid to read what happens next;-)
Thanks. I'm letting them run for now, and hopefully, they won't run into a brier patch that's too tough for me to untangle. :)
DeleteHA! It's funny that at times, WE aren't even sure what's gonna happen next...
LOL... Thanks for the laugh, Susan..... Yes, those ingrates do take over for sure.... but what a FUN and BUMPY ride! I like the fact that you should let the characters should decide when it's done... takes the pressure off us...
ReplyDeleteMy pleasure, dear sir. Yes, it's definitely fun, and since we have a Model A rat rod, I'm obviously okay with an occasional bumpy ride, too. :)
DeleteLovely fun post. With so much truth in it, too. I think that writer's insecurity is a good element to add to your ever-expanding list of ingredients: plot, setting, language, style... and insecurity. What do I do with all this now? :-)
ReplyDeleteGreetings from London.
Thanks. I'm glad you liked it.
DeleteWell, sir, if you've already got plot, setting, language, style, and insecurity well in hand, it's easy to figure out what to do next. You... WRITE!
Greetings back atcha.
Stay safe, stay safe. U r a blogger buddy that I really think of as a friend and I care about. Please keep us informed, if that is possible, as how you and yours are doing.
ReplyDeleteThanks. I really appreciate it. Last we heard, our son and his family are safe and sound, but they can't leave their in-laws' house yet because of a curfew which is in place until 7 tomorrow morning. He's having a fit to get home to make sure his place is still standing, but the most important thing is he, his wife, and kiddies are all okay.
DeleteP.S. The feeling is mutual. Too bad we don't love closer together. :)
Um, it's too bad we don't LIVE closer together, too. HA
DeleteThanks for the update. I am happy to hear that you and your family are safe and sound.
DeleteMe, too! And I'm genuinely touched by your concern.
DeleteAnd the hard work is worth every second. :-)
ReplyDeleteAnna from elements of emaginette
You bet it is!
DeleteOh yes, we're big fans of the fresh eyes perspective. And of letting the characters take control. For us, we see that as a great thing - look, these jokers are practically writing the story for us! Thanks for letting us kick back and relax, guys. I'm gonna go have another brew...
ReplyDeleteGood thinking! Let THEM do the heavy lifting. (If only they could type...)
DeleteI laughed our loud reading about your characters and their dominance over the story. I think it would very interesting to see what wild plot the weave, then come back and trim here and there. Or cut. Great post. Good luck.
ReplyDeleteMade ya laugh! (Then my job here is done...) Yeah, I'm looking forward to seeing how they get me to the ending. (Which I will NOT let them change!)
DeleteThis week has been one foggy commitment after another. Maybe next week I will do better. In the meantime, keep typing away.
ReplyDeleteOne good thing about fog is that it doesn't last forever. :)
DeleteYes, ma'am. I'm typing! I'm typing!
This week has been one foggy commitment after another. Maybe next week I will do better. In the meantime, keep typing away.
ReplyDeleteOnce is good... two is twice as nice!
DeleteBlessings....
ReplyDeleteKeep doing what makes your heart flow.
peace.
Rhapsody
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“The highest education is that which does not merely give us information, but makes our life in harmony with all existence”-Rabindranath Tagore
You, too.
DeleteLove that quote. :)
they'll come back around and give you the respect you deserve or at least a laugh or two. When I try fiction, my characters bore me to death - I wish they'd run a bit willy nilly. Keep plugging away. I bet you are just too hard on yourself. All good!!
ReplyDeleteWell, the characters don't exactly bore me to death. They do sometimes shock me, though. :)
DeleteSorry about your characters, but at least you don't have a full blown mutiny on your hands. I myself like to take notes detailing my characters back stories and have character interviews to know them better. But as soon as I start writing, I sit back and let them take control. For the most part they travel along the path I've set up for them but often they like to take a different route. They've yet to cause a derailment but I still get shocked when they make changes on me. For example, in an urban fantasy story the female character changed her older brother into her younger brother. In my current work in progress and my first romance, my MC changed her receptionist's name from Penny (short for Penelope) to Chrissy (Christine). And made her bi-racial. My male MC changed his supervisor's name too. I had to go back to my notes and make the changes for consistency. Odd thing was, it worked. So I've learned two things: sometimes you really don't know someone as well as you think. And sometimes your character(s) know exactly what they're doing.
ReplyDeleteNope, no full-blown mutiny. At least they're pretty much following my road map, even if they are taking a detour or two.
DeleteMy characters actually did some morphing on me in my first novel, too. One character ended up a young gay Republican, but he sure didn't start out that way. And I didn't intend for a close interracial friendship to turn into a lifelong romance, either. You're right. I think they knew exactly what they were doing... :)
Dear Susan, a writer's club is always a good idea. And reading one's own story with distant eyes (after a while of doing something else) is quite advisable and helpful. I am at the moment so little in blogland because i am "plotting" - can't see the end... but got a real shock when my new macbook behaved strangely - and I hadn't done a back-up --- thought: if the over 300 pages are lost - OMG! But a guy of Apple support helped me with a lot of patience - on the phone - and now I have a backup...
ReplyDeleteOh wow, thank goodness you didn't lose all of those pages. Back up, back up, and back up again! I'm glad the Apple guy was able to fix things for you. (Phew!)
DeleteAww...glad your family is okay.
ReplyDeleteYes, those pages do need new perspective and fresh eyes if time allows.
Thanks. Me, too. Those big trees on their property could have done tremendous damage.
DeleteI'd go a step farther. I think it'd be downright foolish NOT to make time for those fresh eyes and perspectives.
Hello from Alberta, Canada ... just discovered your blog, and still slowly morphing into it ... Love, cat.
ReplyDeleteHi-ya, Cat. Hello from Georgia!
DeleteThanks for stopping by and leaving a comment, and for signing on as a new follower. Welcome aboard! Now it's my turn to return the favor. It's very nice to meet you. :)
My characters are probably thinking the same about me. It seems I've abandoned them all. I feel badly about it. I don't even know if they'd cooperate with me if I decided to come back to them.
ReplyDeleteArlee Bird
Tossing It Out
Oh, I'm sure they'd be verrrry cooperative if you resuscitated them. :)
DeleteI don't think I've ever had a problem with my characters. Arguably my current work is more social and less character driven, but I can't think of any of my works before where I ever had a real problem twisting them to the narrative.
ReplyDeleteThat's the interesting part. It doesn't feel in the least like the characters are "twisting" to the narrative. "Their" way feels quite natural.
Delete